I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit.
I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out.
Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :)
1) I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen.
2) Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro.
3) Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo.
I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications.
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news....
Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right?
I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design.
It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available.
As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process".
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news....
Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity.
“An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said.
https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf...
Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure.
Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!!
Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd.
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[excessive quoting removed by server]
I started using webfaction many years ago because someone on this list mentioned it. I have been very happy. However, now Webfaction has been taken over by Godaddy and none of my old procedures work for some reason. Also, they are not very responsive to questions. For example: I have several web sites on Webfaction and have my DNS server (name.com) pointed to them and it works fine. However, I used to be able to 'hide' things in a sub folder of one of those web sites and allow anyone to see what was there (sometimes with a password). Now I can't do that using FileZilla client. I set the permissions to 777 and there is no access at all. The subfolder can't even be seen in a directory list. Anyone have the same experience?
What I really want to know is if anyone has had good experience with a cheap (Linux?) server where I can put my web sites. I don't need email or any else other than storage, about 150gb or more.
--- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus
I've really liked working with DigitalOcean. I know people combine the DO Server with the NameCheap service for an entire solution.
On 2/22/19 2:41 PM, Ken McGinnis wrote:
I started using webfaction many years ago because someone on this list mentioned it. I have been very happy. However, now Webfaction has been taken over by Godaddy and none of my old procedures work for some reason. Also, they are not very responsive to questions. For example: I have several web sites on Webfaction and have my DNS server (name.com) pointed to them and it works fine. However, I used to be able to 'hide' things in a sub folder of one of those web sites and allow anyone to see what was there (sometimes with a password). Now I can't do that using FileZilla client. I set the permissions to 777 and there is no access at all. The subfolder can't even be seen in a directory list. Anyone have the same experience?
What I really want to know is if anyone has had good experience with a cheap (Linux?) server where I can put my web sites. I don't need email or any else other than storage, about 150gb or more.
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus
[excessive quoting removed by server]
On Feb 22, 2019, at 1:51 PM, Kevin Cully kevin@cully.biz wrote:
I've really liked working with DigitalOcean. I know people combine the DO Server with the NameCheap service for an entire solution.
Like me?
Every ProFox email goes through DO servers. Every ProFox archive search goes through DO servers. And I use NameCheap for my domains.
The technology side of DO is rock-solid, which I really like. But what I like even more is their “how-to” documentation. You can find a over 2000 (!) of them here:
https://www.digitalocean.com/community/tutorials/
-- Ed Leafe
We have a vfp9 SP2 program that has been running nearly bug free for over 10 years. Only now we have a need to find out if anyone else is using the exe in a specific folder. We allow many users to have their own unique folder with their patient data files.
So we log into folder 1 and another user is in folder 2. No problem.
If we log into folder 1 and another user is in that same folder, again no problem. Our software is multi-user down to the individual record level. The problem is when the 2nd user comes in and needs to lock many or all files to reindex or other procedures. How can the 2nd user know that another user is there? Again it is not a problem until that 1st user starts to do something, almost anything that requires accessing files. All files are locked by the 2nd user so the 1st user starts getting errors.
We could try to lock the exe and that would fail so we would know someone else is using the software. However, if that other user is working with data in a different folder, we don't care so we do not want to lock the exe.
Hope that is clear
[excessive quoting removed by server]
Why not create a single file - with a single record, a File Lock Flag. So - when a user goes to reindex files - they MUST Lock that one record 1st. Then, at the startup of your system - for regular users - the system must check that flag & record to see if someone locked it and is indexing files.
It's a thought...
-K-
On 7/23/2019 10:36 AM, Ken McGinnis wrote:
We have a vfp9 SP2 program that has been running nearly bug free for over 10 years. Only now we have a need to find out if anyone else is using the exe in a specific folder. We allow many users to have their own unique folder with their patient data files.
So we log into folder 1 and another user is in folder 2. No problem.
If we log into folder 1 and another user is in that same folder, again no problem. Our software is multi-user down to the individual record level. The problem is when the 2nd user comes in and needs to lock many or all files to reindex or other procedures. How can the 2nd user know that another user is there? Again it is not a problem until that 1st user starts to do something, almost anything that requires accessing files. All files are locked by the 2nd user so the 1st user starts getting errors.
We could try to lock the exe and that would fail so we would know someone else is using the software. However, if that other user is working with data in a different folder, we don't care so we do not want to lock the exe.
Hope that is clear
[excessive quoting removed by server]
Hi, you can make use of Craig Boyd's procedure, you shall have to parse your DBC for every file to find if anything in use and than you can make a message to the other users to please quit the application. But, but, but. Why do you need to reindex? That should be a flaw in your design. Please study again the nessessity and try to redesign. If in any doubt of why/how, advise you to post a new topic. Meanwhile, Craoig's coding:
**Procedure by Craig Boyd **See also Tektips: https://www.tek-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=925399 ?IsTableInUse("C:\mytable.dbf")
FUNCTION IsTableInUse(tcTableName) SET ASSERTS ON ASSERT PCOUNT() > 0 MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table name parameter is required!" ASSERT TYPE("tcTableName") = "C" MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table name parameter must be a character!" ASSERT !EMPTY(tcTableName) MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table name parameter is empty!" ASSERT FILE(tcTableName) MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table does not exist!"
LOCAL lcErrorHandlerWas, llReturn lcErrorHandlerWas = ON("ERROR") ON ERROR llReturn = .T. && Could call proc that checks for ERROR() = 3 "File is in use" USE (tcTableName) IN 0 EXCLUSIVE USE IN SELECT(JUSTSTEM(tcTableName)) ON ERROR &lcErrorHandlerWas RETURN llReturn ENDFUNC
Regards,
Koen
Op di 23 jul. 2019 om 12:58 schreef Kurt @ Gmail kurthwendt@gmail.com:
Why not create a single file - with a single record, a File Lock Flag. So - when a user goes to reindex files - they MUST Lock that one record 1st. Then, at the startup of your system - for regular users - the system must check that flag & record to see if someone locked it and is indexing files.
It's a thought...
-K-
On 7/23/2019 10:36 AM, Ken McGinnis wrote:
We have a vfp9 SP2 program that has been running nearly bug free for over 10 years. Only now we have a need to find out if anyone else is using the exe in a specific folder. We allow many users to have their own unique folder with their patient data files.
So we log into folder 1 and another user is in folder 2. No problem.
If we log into folder 1 and another user is in that same folder, again no problem. Our software is multi-user down to the individual record level. The problem is when the 2nd user comes in and needs to lock many or all files to reindex or other procedures. How can the 2nd user know that another user is there? Again it is not a problem until that 1st user starts to do something, almost anything that requires accessing files. All files are locked by the 2nd user so the 1st user starts getting errors.
We could try to lock the exe and that would fail so we would know someone else is using the software. However, if that other user is working with data in a different folder, we don't care so we do not want to lock the exe.
Hope that is clear
[excessive quoting removed by server]
Hi Koen,
now that's a very old coding style. Probably from the time before TRY/CATCH was invented.
wOOdy
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: ProFox profox-bounces@leafe.com Im Auftrag von Koen Piller Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Juli 2019 20:32 An: ProFox Email List profox@leafe.com Betreff: Re: vfp9 exe
Hi, you can make use of Craig Boyd's procedure, you shall have to parse your DBC for every file to find if anything in use and than you can make a message to the other users to please quit the application. But, but, but. Why do you need to reindex? That should be a flaw in your design. Please study again the nessessity and try to redesign. If in any doubt of why/how, advise you to post a new topic. Meanwhile, Craoig's coding:
**Procedure by Craig Boyd **See also Tektips: https://www.tek-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=925399 ?IsTableInUse("C:\mytable.dbf")
FUNCTION IsTableInUse(tcTableName) SET ASSERTS ON ASSERT PCOUNT() > 0 MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table name parameter is required!" ASSERT TYPE("tcTableName") = "C" MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table name parameter must be a character!" ASSERT !EMPTY(tcTableName) MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table name parameter is empty!" ASSERT FILE(tcTableName) MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table does not exist!"
LOCAL lcErrorHandlerWas, llReturn lcErrorHandlerWas = ON("ERROR") ON ERROR llReturn = .T. && Could call proc that checks for ERROR() = 3 "File is in use" USE (tcTableName) IN 0 EXCLUSIVE USE IN SELECT(JUSTSTEM(tcTableName)) ON ERROR &lcErrorHandlerWas RETURN llReturn ENDFUNC
Regards,
Koen
Op di 23 jul. 2019 om 12:58 schreef Kurt @ Gmail kurthwendt@gmail.com:
Why not create a single file - with a single record, a File Lock Flag. So - when a user goes to reindex files - they MUST Lock that one record 1st. Then, at the startup of your system - for regular users - the system must check that flag & record to see if someone locked it and is indexing files.
It's a thought...
-K-
On 7/23/2019 10:36 AM, Ken McGinnis wrote:
We have a vfp9 SP2 program that has been running nearly bug free for over 10 years. Only now we have a need to find out if anyone else is using the exe in a specific folder. We allow many users to have their own unique folder with their patient data files.
So we log into folder 1 and another user is in folder 2. No problem.
If we log into folder 1 and another user is in that same folder, again no problem. Our software is multi-user down to the individual record level. The problem is when the 2nd user comes in and needs to lock many or all files to reindex or other procedures. How can the 2nd user know that another user is there? Again it is not a problem until that 1st user starts to do something, almost anything that requires accessing files. All files are locked by the 2nd user so the 1st user starts getting errors.
We could try to lock the exe and that would fail so we would know someone else is using the software. However, if that other user is working with data in a different folder, we don't care so we do not want to lock the exe.
Hope that is clear
[excessive quoting removed by server]
Jürgen,
You are cordially invited to adjust the code with a try...catch. Would you wind when you have updated that procedure to upload it here? I can than also refresh my basic library. Thanks , Koen
Op di 23 jul. 2019 om 15:31 schreef juergen@wondzinski.de:
Hi Koen,
now that's a very old coding style. Probably from the time before TRY/CATCH was invented.
wOOdy
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: ProFox profox-bounces@leafe.com Im Auftrag von Koen Piller Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Juli 2019 20:32 An: ProFox Email List profox@leafe.com Betreff: Re: vfp9 exe
Hi, you can make use of Craig Boyd's procedure, you shall have to parse your DBC for every file to find if anything in use and than you can make a message to the other users to please quit the application. But, but, but. Why do you need to reindex? That should be a flaw in your design. Please study again the nessessity and try to redesign. If in any doubt of why/how, advise you to post a new topic. Meanwhile, Craoig's coding:
**Procedure by Craig Boyd **See also Tektips: https://www.tek-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=925399 ?IsTableInUse( https://www.tek-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=925399?IsTableInUse( "C:\mytable.dbf")
FUNCTION IsTableInUse(tcTableName) SET ASSERTS ON ASSERT PCOUNT() > 0 MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table name parameter is required!" ASSERT TYPE("tcTableName") = "C" MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table name parameter must be a character!" ASSERT !EMPTY(tcTableName) MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table name parameter is empty!" ASSERT FILE(tcTableName) MESSAGE "Developer Error: Table does not exist!"
LOCAL lcErrorHandlerWas, llReturn lcErrorHandlerWas = ON("ERROR") ON ERROR llReturn = .T. && Could call proc that checks for ERROR() = 3"File is in use" USE (tcTableName) IN 0 EXCLUSIVE USE IN SELECT(JUSTSTEM(tcTableName)) ON ERROR &lcErrorHandlerWas RETURN llReturn ENDFUNC
Regards,
Koen
Op di 23 jul. 2019 om 12:58 schreef Kurt @ Gmail kurthwendt@gmail.com:
Why not create a single file - with a single record, a File Lock Flag. So - when a user goes to reindex files - they MUST Lock that one record 1st. Then, at the startup of your system - for regular users - the system must check that flag & record to see if someone locked it and is indexing files.
It's a thought...
-K-
On 7/23/2019 10:36 AM, Ken McGinnis wrote:
We have a vfp9 SP2 program that has been running nearly bug free for over 10 years. Only now we have a need to find out if anyone else is using the exe in a specific folder. We allow many users to have their own unique folder with their patient data files.
So we log into folder 1 and another user is in folder 2. No problem.
If we log into folder 1 and another user is in that same folder, again no problem. Our software is multi-user down to the individual record level. The problem is when the 2nd user comes in and needs to lock many or all files to reindex or other procedures. How can the 2nd user know that another user is there? Again it is not a problem until that 1st user starts to do something, almost anything that requires accessing files. All files are locked by the 2nd user so the 1st user starts getting errors.
We could try to lock the exe and that would fail so we would know someone else is using the software. However, if that other user is working with data in a different folder, we don't care so we do not want to lock the exe.
Hope that is clear
[excessive quoting removed by server]
On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 12:36 PM Ken McGinnis kamcginnis@gmail.com wrote:
We could try to lock the exe and that would fail so we would know someone else is using the software. However, if that other user is working with data in a different folder, we don't care so we do not want to lock the exe.
Create a dummy table, "InUse" with a a single record in each folder. When your user goes to use that folder, they try to lock the single record inside a TRY... CATCH. If it fails, it means they can't do any of the functions that would require exclusivity.
The problem is when the 2nd user comes in and needs to lock many
or all files to reindex or other procedures. How can the 2nd user know that another user is there?
In one of our apps, we have an "Everyone Out!" menu pad where we store all the administrative functions. The functions there try to use the shared DBC exclusive and that's the semaphore that they can proceed. No one else can log into the app until the DBC is released, and that happens when they're done with their function, or if they crash, so it automatically cleans up.
Good tips....but this reminds me that I'm soooo glad I switched over to using MySQL in 2004 after seeing Bob Lee's presentation at WhilFest. I never have that problem since then.
On 7/23/2019 4:34 PM, Ted Roche wrote:
On Tue, Jul 23, 2019 at 12:36 PM Ken McGinnis kamcginnis@gmail.com wrote:
We could try to lock the exe and that would fail so we would know someone else is using the software. However, if that other user is working with data in a different folder, we don't care so we do not want to lock the exe.
Create a dummy table, "InUse" with a a single record in each folder. When your user goes to use that folder, they try to lock the single record inside a TRY... CATCH. If it fails, it means they can't do any of the functions that would require exclusivity.
The problem is when the 2nd user comes in and needs to lock many
or all files to reindex or other procedures. How can the 2nd user know that another user is there?
In one of our apps, we have an "Everyone Out!" menu pad where we store all the administrative functions. The functions there try to use the shared DBC exclusive and that's the semaphore that they can proceed. No one else can log into the app until the DBC is released, and that happens when they're done with their function, or if they crash, so it automatically cleans up.
--- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Ken,
I am still a little fuzzy or am missing something. But here are some ideas that might help.
When VFP starts, you can ask it for the folder in which it is located (A SYS function?). When you open a table, you can get the table path using a different function. If the exe and tables are in the same place, you can then have a table with a single row. If some process is going on, it will open the table either exclusively or open it and put a lock on it.
The table could include the name of the respective folders that were used. If the data is somehow opened by a combination that is allowed, then you would add a second record (if/as appropriate) and put the lock on that record (so no exclusive option here.)
So now you know the folders where the exe and data are stored.
After that, you can then have your code continue or alert the user and exit.
Fletcher
Fletcher Johnson FletcherSJohnson@Yahoo.com LinkedIn.com/in/FletcherJohnson twitter.com/fletcherJ strava.com/athletes/fletcherjohnson 408-946-0960 - work 408-781-2345 - cell
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Ken McGinnis Sent: Tuesday, July 23, 2019 10:37 AM To: ProFox@leafe.com >> ProFox Email List Subject: vfp9 exe
We have a vfp9 SP2 program that has been running nearly bug free for over 10 years. Only now we have a need to find out if anyone else is using the exe in a specific folder. We allow many users to have their own unique folder with their patient data files.
So we log into folder 1 and another user is in folder 2. No problem.
If we log into folder 1 and another user is in that same folder, again no problem. Our software is multi-user down to the individual record level. The problem is when the 2nd user comes in and needs to lock many or all files to reindex or other procedures. How can the 2nd user know that another user is there? Again it is not a problem until that 1st user starts to do something, almost anything that requires accessing files. All files are locked by the 2nd user so the 1st user starts getting errors.
We could try to lock the exe and that would fail so we would know someone else is using the software. However, if that other user is working with data in a different folder, we don't care so we do not want to lock the exe.
Hope that is clear
[excessive quoting removed by server]
Function reindex as boolean Local llResult as boolean Try Open database bleh excl Use mytable Reindex llResult =.t. Catch to loEx ? 'Sorry,' + loEx.message Finally Close database bleh Endtry
Return llResult
I don't personally use it, yet. But it comes highly recommended from a co-worker. https://www.digitalocean.com/products/droplets/ It looks like you can add additional space to a $5/mo vps to get the size you need for about $15/mo.
Or you can consider the Spaces if all you are doing is sharing files 250 GB is $5/mo. https://www.digitalocean.com/products/spaces/
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Ken McGinnis Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 2:41 PM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: Webfaction question
I started using webfaction many years ago because someone on this list mentioned it. I have been very happy. However, now Webfaction has been taken over by Godaddy and none of my old procedures work for some reason. Also, they are not very responsive to questions. For example: I have several web sites on Webfaction and have my DNS server (name.com) pointed to them and it works fine. However, I used to be able to 'hide' things in a sub folder of one of those web sites and allow anyone to see what was there (sometimes with a password). Now I can't do that using FileZilla client. I set the permissions to 777 and there is no access at all. The subfolder can't even be seen in a directory list. Anyone have the same experience?
What I really want to know is if anyone has had good experience with a cheap (Linux?) server where I can put my web sites. I don't need email or any else other than storage, about 150gb or more.
--- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus
[excessive quoting removed by server]
Hi Ken,
I may have been one of those cheerleaders that steered you to Webfaction. Webfaction was great back in the day, but over the past few years they seemed to coast on their success. I'm no fan of GoDaddy - if they're the new owner, then Webfaction is doomed.
Like Tracy, I've heard good things about Digital Ocean. Amazon AWS also offers a competitively priced Webfaction equivalent called Lightsail. Let us know who you finally end up with.
Malcolm
I just spent over 4 hours on digitalocean. I signed up. I was impressed by reviews that it is good. It seem to be using the Amazon AWS resources? not sure. Anyway I spent hours trying to figure it out. First, I admit that I have not set up web sites in over 15 years, but I manage over 10 web sites on Webfaction and they all work fine - until recently when I can't seem to access files in a subfolder.
Digitalocean.com uses something they call 'projects', 'droplets' and 'spaces'. Sorry, but I guess I am too old and I have not kept up. Those mean nothing to me. Projects I guess I can figure out. but droplets? Google (my wonder answer to all questions) does not give me anything that I can understand.
Spaces? I guess that is a 'space' on the server? I was able to set up a 'space' (whatever that is) and I could copy files to it using their utility. All that is fairly obvious. After getting that far, i was able to ask Google a question it could answer and I found other users who had the same issue that I had. What I wanted was internet storage with a URL that worked in a browser. Is that asking too much? Another 'answer' to someone's question stated that there was no concept of a subfolder?? That simply makes no sense to me. So all the files must be in the root of the space? crazy. I know I must be missing something.
Maybe I am getting too old for this stuff? I am a good programmer in fox for over 30 years and I have designed over 20 web sites using hand coded html including a web site for my kids middle school. It works on Webfaction except for this new issue since they sold out to GoDaddy? You would think I could get through all these new terms (new to me). I must have read a dozen tutorials and websites with questions and answers and it simply 'does not compute'.
If anyone else tries to use digitalocean for a simple html website and is successful, I would like to know how, a link, anything that would help.
Ken
On 2/22/2019 12:45 PM, Malcolm Greene wrote:
Hi Ken,
I may have been one of those cheerleaders that steered you to Webfaction. Webfaction was great back in the day, but over the past few years they seemed to coast on their success. I'm no fan of GoDaddy - if they're the new owner, then Webfaction is doomed.
Like Tracy, I've heard good things about Digital Ocean. Amazon AWS also offers a competitively priced Webfaction equivalent called Lightsail. Let us know who you finally end up with.
Malcolm
[excessive quoting removed by server]
If you just want to do simple websites - have you considered Wix? I don't use it - but, I think I have heard good things about it!
-K-
On 2/23/2019 6:20 PM, Ken McGinnis wrote:
I just spent over 4 hours on digitalocean. I signed up. I was impressed by reviews that it is good. It seem to be using the Amazon AWS resources? not sure. Anyway I spent hours trying to figure it out. First, I admit that I have not set up web sites in over 15 years, but I manage over 10 web sites on Webfaction and they all work fine - until recently when I can't seem to access files in a subfolder.
Digitalocean.com uses something they call 'projects', 'droplets' and 'spaces'. Sorry, but I guess I am too old and I have not kept up. Those mean nothing to me. Projects I guess I can figure out. but droplets? Google (my wonder answer to all questions) does not give me anything that I can understand.
Spaces? I guess that is a 'space' on the server? I was able to set up a 'space' (whatever that is) and I could copy files to it using their utility. All that is fairly obvious. After getting that far, i was able to ask Google a question it could answer and I found other users who had the same issue that I had. What I wanted was internet storage with a URL that worked in a browser. Is that asking too much? Another 'answer' to someone's question stated that there was no concept of a subfolder?? That simply makes no sense to me. So all the files must be in the root of the space? crazy. I know I must be missing something.
Maybe I am getting too old for this stuff? I am a good programmer in fox for over 30 years and I have designed over 20 web sites using hand coded html including a web site for my kids middle school. It works on Webfaction except for this new issue since they sold out to GoDaddy? You would think I could get through all these new terms (new to me). I must have read a dozen tutorials and websites with questions and answers and it simply 'does not compute'.
If anyone else tries to use digitalocean for a simple html website and is successful, I would like to know how, a link, anything that would help.
Ken
On 2/22/2019 12:45 PM, Malcolm Greene wrote:
Hi Ken,
I may have been one of those cheerleaders that steered you to Webfaction. Webfaction was great back in the day, but over the past few years they seemed to coast on their success. I'm no fan of GoDaddy - if they're the new owner, then Webfaction is doomed.
Like Tracy, I've heard good things about Digital Ocean. Amazon AWS also offers a competitively priced Webfaction equivalent called Lightsail. Let us know who you finally end up with.
Malcolm
[excessive quoting removed by server]
I figured out the solution to the issue I had. (with the help of Webfaction support). I had deleted a critical file. Everything seems to be working now. They need a 'user interface' to help set up web sites. Maybe they do have it, I don't know. I have always designed everything while working in M$ Windows and then FileZilla client to copy files to WebFaction.
On 2/23/2019 6:46 PM, Kurt @ Gmail wrote:
If you just want to do simple websites - have you considered Wix? I don't use it - but, I think I have heard good things about it!
-K-
On 2/23/2019 6:20 PM, Ken McGinnis wrote:
I just spent over 4 hours on digitalocean. I signed up. I was impressed by reviews that it is good. It seem to be using the Amazon AWS resources? not sure. Anyway I spent hours trying to figure it out. First, I admit that I have not set up web sites in over 15 years, but I manage over 10 web sites on Webfaction and they all work fine - until recently when I can't seem to access files in a subfolder.
Digitalocean.com uses something they call 'projects', 'droplets' and 'spaces'. Sorry, but I guess I am too old and I have not kept up. Those mean nothing to me. Projects I guess I can figure out. but droplets? Google (my wonder answer to all questions) does not give me anything that I can understand.
Spaces? I guess that is a 'space' on the server? I was able to set up a 'space' (whatever that is) and I could copy files to it using their utility. All that is fairly obvious. After getting that far, i was able to ask Google a question it could answer and I found other users who had the same issue that I had. What I wanted was internet storage with a URL that worked in a browser. Is that asking too much? Another 'answer' to someone's question stated that there was no concept of a subfolder?? That simply makes no sense to me. So all the files must be in the root of the space? crazy. I know I must be missing something.
Maybe I am getting too old for this stuff? I am a good programmer in fox for over 30 years and I have designed over 20 web sites using hand coded html including a web site for my kids middle school. It works on Webfaction except for this new issue since they sold out to GoDaddy? You would think I could get through all these new terms (new to me). I must have read a dozen tutorials and websites with questions and answers and it simply 'does not compute'.
If anyone else tries to use digitalocean for a simple html website and is successful, I would like to know how, a link, anything that would help.
Ken
On 2/22/2019 12:45 PM, Malcolm Greene wrote:
Hi Ken,
I may have been one of those cheerleaders that steered you to Webfaction. Webfaction was great back in the day, but over the past few years they seemed to coast on their success. I'm no fan of GoDaddy - if they're the new owner, then Webfaction is doomed.
Like Tracy, I've heard good things about Digital Ocean. Amazon AWS also offers a competitively priced Webfaction equivalent called Lightsail. Let us know who you finally end up with.
Malcolm
[excessive quoting removed by server]
There's a lot there. I'm out of time for the day unfortunately. Let me give you a full response on my thoughts on migrating to Xojo on Monday sometime.
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Paul H. Tarver Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 12:04 PM To: profox@leafe.com Subject: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit.
I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out.
Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :)
1) I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen.
2) Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro.
3) Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo.
I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications.
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news....
Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right?
I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design.
It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available.
As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process".
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news....
Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity.
“An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said.
https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf...
Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure.
Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!!
Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd.
﴾⚆ᨎ⚆﴿
Flexipol® Packaging Ltd T 01706 222 792 E DCrozier@flexipol.co.uk W https://www.flexipol.co.uk/ Follow us: Unit 14 Bentwood Road, Carrs Industrial Estate, Haslingden, Lancashire, BB4 5HH
This communication and the information it contains is intended for the person or organisation to whom it is addressed. Its contents are confidential and may be protected in law. If you have received this e-mail in error you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. Unauthorised use, copying or disclosure of any of it may be unlawful. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or email.
Flexipol Packaging Ltd. has taken every reasonable precaution to minimise the risk of virus transmission through email and therefore any files sent via e-mail will have been checked for known viruses. However, you are advised to run your own virus check before opening any attachments received as Flexipol Packaging Ltd will not in any event accept any liability whatsoever once an e-mail and/or any attachment is received.
It is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they have adequate virus protection.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Terms & Conditions: Notwithstanding delivery and the passing of risk in the goods, the property in the goods shall not pass to the buyer until the seller Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ("The Company") has received in cash or cleared funds payment in full of the price of the goods and all other goods agreed to be sold by the seller to the buyer for which payment is then due. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer, the buyer shall hold the goods as the seller's fiduciary agent and bailee and keep the goods separate from those of the buyer and third parties and properly stored protected and insured and identified as the seller's property but shall be entitled to resell or use the goods in the ordinary course of its business. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer the seller shall be entitled at any time
--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/jpeg image/jpeg image/png image/png image/png image/png ---
[excessive quoting removed by server]
_______________________________________________ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://mail.leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://mail.leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/005b01d4cad0$bce77240$36b656c0$@tpcqp... ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
It might sound off-topic, but seeing the Xojo style, gives me the impression it is a total rewrite in a VB style language.
I would suggest you rather look at an XBase language like XSharp which you might be surprised have a very similar coding style to FoxPro. Might have your code converted a lot quicker than any other way. Open source, actively developed, .NET based on the MicroSoft C# compiler's open source project Roslyn.
Johan Nel
On 2019/02/22 23:56, Kevin J Cully wrote:
There's a lot there. I'm out of time for the day unfortunately. Let me give you a full response on my thoughts on migrating to Xojo on Monday sometime.
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Paul H. Tarver Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 12:04 PM To: profox@leafe.com Subject: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit.
I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out.
Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :)
I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen.
Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro.
Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo.
I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications.
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news....
Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right?
I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design.
It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available.
As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process".
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news....
Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity.
“An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said.
https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf...
Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure.
Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!!
Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd.
﴾⚆ᨎ⚆﴿
Flexipol® Packaging Ltd T 01706 222 792 E DCrozier@flexipol.co.uk W https://www.flexipol.co.uk/ Follow us: Unit 14 Bentwood Road, Carrs Industrial Estate, Haslingden, Lancashire, BB4 5HH
This communication and the information it contains is intended for the person or organisation to whom it is addressed. Its contents are confidential and may be protected in law. If you have received this e-mail in error you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. Unauthorised use, copying or disclosure of any of it may be unlawful. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or email.
Flexipol Packaging Ltd. has taken every reasonable precaution to minimise the risk of virus transmission through email and therefore any files sent via e-mail will have been checked for known viruses. However, you are advised to run your own virus check before opening any attachments received as Flexipol Packaging Ltd will not in any event accept any liability whatsoever once an e-mail and/or any attachment is received.
It is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they have adequate virus protection.
Terms & Conditions: Notwithstanding delivery and the passing of risk in the goods, the property in the goods shall not pass to the buyer until the seller Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ("The Company") has received in cash or cleared funds payment in full of the price of the goods and all other goods agreed to be sold by the seller to the buyer for which payment is then due. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer, the buyer shall hold the goods as the seller's fiduciary agent and bailee and keep the goods separate from those of the buyer and third parties and properly stored protected and insured and identified as the seller's property but shall be entitled to resell or use the goods in the ordinary course of its business. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer the seller shall be entitled at any time
--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/jpeg image/jpeg image/png image/png image/png image/png
[excessive quoting removed by server]
Thanks! Paul
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 22, 2019, at 3:56 PM, Kevin J Cully kjcully@cherokeega.com wrote:
There's a lot there. I'm out of time for the day unfortunately. Let me give you a full response on my thoughts on migrating to Xojo on Monday sometime.
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Paul H. Tarver Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 12:04 PM To: profox@leafe.com Subject: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit.
I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out.
Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :)
I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen.
Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro.
Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo.
I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications.
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news....
Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right?
I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design.
It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available.
As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process".
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news....
Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity.
“An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said.
https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf...
Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure.
Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!!
Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd.
﴾⚆ᨎ⚆﴿
Flexipol® Packaging Ltd T 01706 222 792 E DCrozier@flexipol.co.uk W https://www.flexipol.co.uk/ Follow us: Unit 14 Bentwood Road, Carrs Industrial Estate, Haslingden, Lancashire, BB4 5HH
This communication and the information it contains is intended for the person or organisation to whom it is addressed. Its contents are confidential and may be protected in law. If you have received this e-mail in error you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. Unauthorised use, copying or disclosure of any of it may be unlawful. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or email.
Flexipol Packaging Ltd. has taken every reasonable precaution to minimise the risk of virus transmission through email and therefore any files sent via e-mail will have been checked for known viruses. However, you are advised to run your own virus check before opening any attachments received as Flexipol Packaging Ltd will not in any event accept any liability whatsoever once an e-mail and/or any attachment is received.
It is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they have adequate virus protection.
Terms & Conditions: Notwithstanding delivery and the passing of risk in the goods, the property in the goods shall not pass to the buyer until the seller Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ("The Company") has received in cash or cleared funds payment in full of the price of the goods and all other goods agreed to be sold by the seller to the buyer for which payment is then due. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer, the buyer shall hold the goods as the seller's fiduciary agent and bailee and keep the goods separate from those of the buyer and third parties and properly stored protected and insured and identified as the seller's property but shall be entitled to resell or use the goods in the ordinary course of its business. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer the seller shall be entitled at any time
--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/jpeg image/jpeg image/png image/png image/png image/png
[excessive quoting removed by server]
Hello Paul and other potentially Xojo interested parties,
First thing to remember is that Xojo is not Foxpro. It has different strengths and weaknesses. I love programming in it as I find it simple and easy to get started, but doesn't have many limitations to what it can do. Sound like Foxpro? You would *never* program a modern video game in Xojo however. That also sounds like Foxpro.
If you don't like Xojo, no problem. We can still be friends. Don't like the closed source nature of it? Too expensive? Not enough events? Not data centric enough? I get it.
There is a lot to like however. 1. First, it's not owned by Microsoft. Xojo is a USA based small company that has been around for over 20 years, and has their developers and staff spread out throughout the world. And they are really nice people that are interested in developing a great product. 2. You can develop desktop, web and console applications. Yup, with a singular code base of classes, you can share them across projects that target these different project types. 3. It is multi-platform: Winblows, Mac, Linux, Raspberry Pi (Linux), and iOS. Android apps coming soon but I'm not sure exactly when. 4. You can get started for free! You can download the IDE and build as many applications as you like and use it forever without paying Xojo one cent. You only need a license when you build and application (such as an EXE on Windows) and a license for the target platform. I prefer the "Xojo Pro" license as it gets all of the platforms I am interested in. 5. Licensing is reasonable in cost and scope. The cost for a Pro license is $700 and gets you all updates for a year (typically 3-4 releases in a year) and you can build for almost any platform. If you let your license lapse, you can continue to use that Xojo IDE forever, you just won't get updates. A lot of developers pay for a license every other year as a cost savings plan. You can develop as many solutions and deploy to as many customers as you like. You don't need to let Xojo know about any of it! There were several other "VFP Replacements" that wanted to know about your customers. Unacceptable in my mind. 6. Xojo uses native controls. This is foreign to us. VFP runs only on Windows and we don't even think about the fact that they are windows controls. Remember running old Java applications and Windows and they seemed "funny"? The controls didn't look right? That's because they were drawn in Java. Mac people hate that. Hate that with a passion. A Mac app needs to look and work like a Mac app. Xojo (appropriately) made the design decision that all platforms will use the target platform native controls. Windows apps work and look like Windows apps. Linux apps look and feel like Linux apps. Etc. Don't underestimate how important this decision was. This also means that Xojo can be handcuffed to operating on the least-common-denominator of events and controls however. Not seeing your favorite control built into Xojo? It might be because it isn't available on all platforms. Don't panic! You can add it yourself or purchase it from a 3rd party supplier. 7. Xojo is database agnostic. It natively works with SQLite out of the box, but has plugins to interface with Microsoft SQL Server, MySQL, PostgreSQL, and anything you can access with ODBC. Not seeing your favorite database there? There may be a plugin available either open sourced or as a paid solution. MongoDB anyone? 8. Xojo holds a conference every year called XDC. (https://www.xojo.com/xdc/ ) At the conference will be the president of Xojo Geoff Perlman, their marketing staff, and almost every single engineer and technical support staff in the company. You can eat breakfast, lunch and dinner with each of them. Amazing really. Did Microsoft send the engineers to the Foxpro conferences? Not that I can remember. Perhaps they did. But, every single year Xojo steps up to the plate. 9. The same good feeling you have with developing in VFP, you can have in Xojo. Quickly prototype a solution? Grow a small system into a large 10. You can deploy web apps to Xojo Cloud with a single click (although it is a little pricy) or you can deploy to a Linux server such as a Digital Ocean droplet for as little as $5 per month (or something like $0.07 per hour). That's really cool. Getting Foxpro supported hosting was pretty expensive and hard. YMMV. 11. Don't like the book to learn Xojo? Check out the Xojo YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/goxojo 12. Want to learn Xojo by example? Xojo comes with *hundreds* of examples covering many many subjects. When I'm trying something that I've never done before, I just click the "New Project > Examples" and choose from the plethora of examples. I wish Foxpro had that many examples when I got started decades ago. 13. I've developed a "VFP" class for Xojo to help. Want STRTOFILE() and FILETOSTR() that works cross-platform? STRTRAN()? You can even ADDBS()? I'm happy to share that and it helps ease the transition to Xojo. Eventually I stopped using these functions and went native, but it was nice to transition. ... There is more good stuff about Xojo, but I'll stop here ...
Is it all good stuff? Heck no. 1. You cannot press a magic button and convert over your VFP solutions. The languages are cousins of each other, but it will still be a rewrite. I chose to just write new applications in Xojo and eventually I got to all Xojo. 2. Data handling is different. Xojo uses recordsets and not cursors. You handle the data a bit more "manually" than the magic of ControlSources. It wasn't a big deal to me, but it does keep you from creating forms with millions of data controls. That might be a good thing? 3. The built in report writer is pitiful. For the most part, I write my reports out to HTML/CSS and display into the browser. There is a 3rd party report writer called Bikini Shorts that is really powerful and wicked fast. (https://bkeeney.com/allproducts/bkeeney-shorts/ ) 4. The Xojo community is pretty nice for the most part, but there are a couple of people that are mean and petty. Be prepared to go into the Xojo forum and read some of that. I think they're full of piss and vinegar because they know that Xojo cares and is listening. For some people, the sky is always falling. Some people just want to see the world burn. Most people are very kind and helpful. That's the aspect to focus on and forget the nasty people. We don't have time for that. ...
Okay. My fingers are moving on to other tasks. All I can say is that I like it and I've created some good business solutions for my employer that I think have made things better! Take Xojo for a spin. I like it and you may as well.
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 4:57 PM To: ProFox Email List profox@leafe.com Subject: RE: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
There's a lot there. I'm out of time for the day unfortunately. Let me give you a full response on my thoughts on migrating to Xojo on Monday sometime.
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Paul H. Tarver Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 12:04 PM To: profox@leafe.com Subject: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit.
I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out.
Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :)
1) I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen.
2) Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro.
3) Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo.
I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications.
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news....
Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right?
I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design.
It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available.
As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process".
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news....
Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity.
“An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said.
https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf...
Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure.
Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!!
Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd.
﴾⚆ᨎ⚆﴿
Flexipol® Packaging Ltd T 01706 222 792 E DCrozier@flexipol.co.uk W https://www.flexipol.co.uk/ Follow us: Unit 14 Bentwood Road, Carrs Industrial Estate, Haslingden, Lancashire, BB4 5HH
This communication and the information it contains is intended for the person or organisation to whom it is addressed. Its contents are confidential and may be protected in law. If you have received this e-mail in error you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. Unauthorised use, copying or disclosure of any of it may be unlawful. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or email.
Flexipol Packaging Ltd. has taken every reasonable precaution to minimise the risk of virus transmission through email and therefore any files sent via e-mail will have been checked for known viruses. However, you are advised to run your own virus check before opening any attachments received as Flexipol Packaging Ltd will not in any event accept any liability whatsoever once an e-mail and/or any attachment is received.
It is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they have adequate virus protection.
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_______________________________________________ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://mail.leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://mail.leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/005b01d4cad0$bce77240$36b656c0$@tpcqp... ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious. _______________________________________________ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://mail.leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://mail.leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/DM6PR09MB3514CA6FB9F8229F1BCE5FD9C57F... ** All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
Kevin,
I wanted to follow up and let you know based on your recommendations, I have been playing around with Xojo in a more in-depth way for the last 30 days and while I can't say I'm expert by any stretch, I've been able to piece together a little bit of working code using some of the examples and I'm fairly happy with what I've accomplished so far. I'm approaching Xojo differently this time (thanks to you) and I think perhaps this third attempt to learn Xojo may be more successful.
First, I chose a project to convert from Foxpro to Xojo which is relatively uncomplicated and makes sense to build in Xojo instead of trying to replicate my main production work environment at this point.
Secondly, I've challenged myself to spend 30-60 minutes each day to make just one thing work in the new project. Maybe it is just making a splash screen, or creating a screen to add or edit items to a simple table, or figuring out how to pass parameters to a window or use a new class/method/property/etc. By limiting my time in Xojo, I don't get too frustrated and because the daily goals are small, I get to celebrate a small win each day instead of feeling like a failure because I'm still miles away from the finished product. This strategy also gives me time in between sessions to think and process what I've been working on and that has helped with my understanding greatly. Some days I simply re-do what I did the day before because having thought about it, I come up with a better way to accomplish the same thing.
Finally and most importantly, I've come to accept this will not be a quick transition and accepting that fact has let me focus on the fun of learning instead of the stress of trying to get a job done.
I'll post some updates later if anyone is interested in this journey with Xojo I've started.
Thanks for all your comments and input!
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Monday, February 25, 2019 10:53 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
Hello Paul and other potentially Xojo interested parties,
First thing to remember is that Xojo is not Foxpro. It has different strengths and weaknesses. I love programming in it as I find it simple and easy to get started, but doesn't have many limitations to what it can do. Sound like Foxpro? You would *never* program a modern video game in Xojo however. That also sounds like Foxpro.
If you don't like Xojo, no problem. We can still be friends. Don't like the closed source nature of it? Too expensive? Not enough events? Not data centric enough? I get it.
There is a lot to like however. 1. First, it's not owned by Microsoft. Xojo is a USA based small company that has been around for over 20 years, and has their developers and staff spread out throughout the world. And they are really nice people that are interested in developing a great product. 2. You can develop desktop, web and console applications. Yup, with a singular code base of classes, you can share them across projects that target these different project types. 3. It is multi-platform: Winblows, Mac, Linux, Raspberry Pi (Linux), and iOS. Android apps coming soon but I'm not sure exactly when. 4. You can get started for free! You can download the IDE and build as many applications as you like and use it forever without paying Xojo one cent. You only need a license when you build and application (such as an EXE on Windows) and a license for the target platform. I prefer the "Xojo Pro" license as it gets all of the platforms I am interested in. 5. Licensing is reasonable in cost and scope. The cost for a Pro license is $700 and gets you all updates for a year (typically 3-4 releases in a year) and you can build for almost any platform. If you let your license lapse, you can continue to use that Xojo IDE forever, you just won't get updates. A lot of developers pay for a license every other year as a cost savings plan. You can develop as many solutions and deploy to as many customers as you like. You don't need to let Xojo know about any of it! There were several other "VFP Replacements" that wanted to know about your customers. Unacceptable in my mind. 6. Xojo uses native controls. This is foreign to us. VFP runs only on Windows and we don't even think about the fact that they are windows controls. Remember running old Java applications and Windows and they seemed "funny"? The controls didn't look right? That's because they were drawn in Java. Mac people hate that. Hate that with a passion. A Mac app needs to look and work like a Mac app. Xojo (appropriately) made the design decision that all platforms will use the target platform native controls. Windows apps work and look like Windows apps. Linux apps look and feel like Linux apps. Etc. Don't underestimate how important this decision was. This also means that Xojo can be handcuffed to operating on the least-common-denominator of events and controls however. Not seeing your favorite control built into Xojo? It might be because it isn't available on all platforms. Don't panic! You can add it yourself or purchase it from a 3rd party supplier. 7. Xojo is database agnostic. It natively works with SQLite out of the box, but has plugins to interface with Microsoft SQL Server, MySQL, PostgreSQL, and anything you can access with ODBC. Not seeing your favorite database there? There may be a plugin available either open sourced or as a paid solution. MongoDB anyone? 8. Xojo holds a conference every year called XDC. (https://www.xojo.com/xdc/ ) At the conference will be the president of Xojo Geoff Perlman, their marketing staff, and almost every single engineer and technical support staff in the company. You can eat breakfast, lunch and dinner with each of them. Amazing really. Did Microsoft send the engineers to the Foxpro conferences? Not that I can remember. Perhaps they did. But, every single year Xojo steps up to the plate. 9. The same good feeling you have with developing in VFP, you can have in Xojo. Quickly prototype a solution? Grow a small system into a large 10. You can deploy web apps to Xojo Cloud with a single click (although it is a little pricy) or you can deploy to a Linux server such as a Digital Ocean droplet for as little as $5 per month (or something like $0.07 per hour). That's really cool. Getting Foxpro supported hosting was pretty expensive and hard. YMMV. 11. Don't like the book to learn Xojo? Check out the Xojo YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/goxojo 12. Want to learn Xojo by example? Xojo comes with *hundreds* of examples covering many many subjects. When I'm trying something that I've never done before, I just click the "New Project > Examples" and choose from the plethora of examples. I wish Foxpro had that many examples when I got started decades ago. 13. I've developed a "VFP" class for Xojo to help. Want STRTOFILE() and FILETOSTR() that works cross-platform? STRTRAN()? You can even ADDBS()? I'm happy to share that and it helps ease the transition to Xojo. Eventually I stopped using these functions and went native, but it was nice to transition. ... There is more good stuff about Xojo, but I'll stop here ...
Is it all good stuff? Heck no. 1. You cannot press a magic button and convert over your VFP solutions. The languages are cousins of each other, but it will still be a rewrite. I chose to just write new applications in Xojo and eventually I got to all Xojo. 2. Data handling is different. Xojo uses recordsets and not cursors. You handle the data a bit more "manually" than the magic of ControlSources. It wasn't a big deal to me, but it does keep you from creating forms with millions of data controls. That might be a good thing? 3. The built in report writer is pitiful. For the most part, I write my reports out to HTML/CSS and display into the browser. There is a 3rd party report writer called Bikini Shorts that is really powerful and wicked fast. (https://bkeeney.com/allproducts/bkeeney-shorts/ ) 4. The Xojo community is pretty nice for the most part, but there are a couple of people that are mean and petty. Be prepared to go into the Xojo forum and read some of that. I think they're full of piss and vinegar because they know that Xojo cares and is listening. For some people, the sky is always falling. Some people just want to see the world burn. Most people are very kind and helpful. That's the aspect to focus on and forget the nasty people. We don't have time for that. ...
Okay. My fingers are moving on to other tasks. All I can say is that I like it and I've created some good business solutions for my employer that I think have made things better! Take Xojo for a spin. I like it and you may as well.
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 4:57 PM To: ProFox Email List profox@leafe.com Subject: RE: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
There's a lot there. I'm out of time for the day unfortunately. Let me give you a full response on my thoughts on migrating to Xojo on Monday sometime.
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Paul H. Tarver Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 12:04 PM To: profox@leafe.com Subject: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit.
I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out.
Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :)
1) I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen.
2) Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro.
3) Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo.
I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications.
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news....
Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right?
I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design.
It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available.
As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process".
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news....
Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity.
“An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said.
https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf...
Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure.
Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!!
Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd.
﴾⚆ᨎ⚆﴿
Flexipol® Packaging Ltd T 01706 222 792 E DCrozier@flexipol.co.uk W https://www.flexipol.co.uk/ Follow us: Unit 14 Bentwood Road, Carrs Industrial Estate, Haslingden, Lancashire, BB4 5HH
This communication and the information it contains is intended for the person or organisation to whom it is addressed. Its contents are confidential and may be protected in law. If you have received this e-mail in error you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. Unauthorised use, copying or disclosure of any of it may be unlawful. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or email.
Flexipol Packaging Ltd. has taken every reasonable precaution to minimise the risk of virus transmission through email and therefore any files sent via e-mail will have been checked for known viruses. However, you are advised to run your own virus check before opening any attachments received as Flexipol Packaging Ltd will not in any event accept any liability whatsoever once an e-mail and/or any attachment is received.
It is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they have adequate virus protection.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Terms & Conditions: Notwithstanding delivery and the passing of risk in the goods, the property in the goods shall not pass to the buyer until the seller Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ("The Company") has received in cash or cleared funds payment in full of the price of the goods and all other goods agreed to be sold by the seller to the buyer for which payment is then due. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer, the buyer shall hold the goods as the seller's fiduciary agent and bailee and keep the goods separate from those of the buyer and third parties and properly stored protected and insured and identified as the seller's property but shall be entitled to resell or use the goods in the ordinary course of its business. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer the seller shall be entitled at any time
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[excessive quoting removed by server]
That sounds great Paul! I really enjoy Xojo and the language syntax seems to make sense to my VFP side of my brain.
-Kevin
On 4/1/19 5:05 PM, Paul H. Tarver wrote:
Kevin,
I wanted to follow up and let you know based on your recommendations, I have been playing around with Xojo in a more in-depth way for the last 30 days and while I can't say I'm expert by any stretch, I've been able to piece together a little bit of working code using some of the examples and I'm fairly happy with what I've accomplished so far. I'm approaching Xojo differently this time (thanks to you) and I think perhaps this third attempt to learn Xojo may be more successful.
First, I chose a project to convert from Foxpro to Xojo which is relatively uncomplicated and makes sense to build in Xojo instead of trying to replicate my main production work environment at this point.
Secondly, I've challenged myself to spend 30-60 minutes each day to make just one thing work in the new project. Maybe it is just making a splash screen, or creating a screen to add or edit items to a simple table, or figuring out how to pass parameters to a window or use a new class/method/property/etc. By limiting my time in Xojo, I don't get too frustrated and because the daily goals are small, I get to celebrate a small win each day instead of feeling like a failure because I'm still miles away from the finished product. This strategy also gives me time in between sessions to think and process what I've been working on and that has helped with my understanding greatly. Some days I simply re-do what I did the day before because having thought about it, I come up with a better way to accomplish the same thing.
Finally and most importantly, I've come to accept this will not be a quick transition and accepting that fact has let me focus on the fun of learning instead of the stress of trying to get a job done.
I'll post some updates later if anyone is interested in this journey with Xojo I've started.
Thanks for all your comments and input!
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Monday, February 25, 2019 10:53 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
Hello Paul and other potentially Xojo interested parties,
First thing to remember is that Xojo is not Foxpro. It has different strengths and weaknesses. I love programming in it as I find it simple and easy to get started, but doesn't have many limitations to what it can do. Sound like Foxpro? You would *never* program a modern video game in Xojo however. That also sounds like Foxpro.
If you don't like Xojo, no problem. We can still be friends. Don't like the closed source nature of it? Too expensive? Not enough events? Not data centric enough? I get it.
There is a lot to like however.
- First, it's not owned by Microsoft. Xojo is a USA based small company that has been around for over 20 years, and has their developers and staff spread out throughout the world. And they are really nice people that are interested in developing a great product.
- You can develop desktop, web and console applications. Yup, with a singular code base of classes, you can share them across projects that target these different project types.
- It is multi-platform: Winblows, Mac, Linux, Raspberry Pi (Linux), and iOS. Android apps coming soon but I'm not sure exactly when.
- You can get started for free! You can download the IDE and build as many applications as you like and use it forever without paying Xojo one cent. You only need a license when you build and application (such as an EXE on Windows) and a license for the target platform. I prefer the "Xojo Pro" license as it gets all of the platforms I am interested in.
- Licensing is reasonable in cost and scope. The cost for a Pro license is $700 and gets you all updates for a year (typically 3-4 releases in a year) and you can build for almost any platform. If you let your license lapse, you can continue to use that Xojo IDE forever, you just won't get updates. A lot of developers pay for a license every other year as a cost savings plan. You can develop as many solutions and deploy to as many customers as you like. You don't need to let Xojo know about any of it! There were several other "VFP Replacements" that wanted to know about your customers. Unacceptable in my mind.
- Xojo uses native controls. This is foreign to us. VFP runs only on Windows and we don't even think about the fact that they are windows controls. Remember running old Java applications and Windows and they seemed "funny"? The controls didn't look right? That's because they were drawn in Java. Mac people hate that. Hate that with a passion. A Mac app needs to look and work like a Mac app. Xojo (appropriately) made the design decision that all platforms will use the target platform native controls. Windows apps work and look like Windows apps. Linux apps look and feel like Linux apps. Etc. Don't underestimate how important this decision was. This also means that Xojo can be handcuffed to operating on the least-common-denominator of events and controls however. Not seeing your favorite control built into Xojo? It might be because it isn't available on all platforms. Don't panic! You can add it yourself or purchase it from a 3rd party supplier.
- Xojo is database agnostic. It natively works with SQLite out of the box, but has plugins to interface with Microsoft SQL Server, MySQL, PostgreSQL, and anything you can access with ODBC. Not seeing your favorite database there? There may be a plugin available either open sourced or as a paid solution. MongoDB anyone?
- Xojo holds a conference every year called XDC. (https://www.xojo.com/xdc/ ) At the conference will be the president of Xojo Geoff Perlman, their marketing staff, and almost every single engineer and technical support staff in the company. You can eat breakfast, lunch and dinner with each of them. Amazing really. Did Microsoft send the engineers to the Foxpro conferences? Not that I can remember. Perhaps they did. But, every single year Xojo steps up to the plate.
- The same good feeling you have with developing in VFP, you can have in Xojo. Quickly prototype a solution? Grow a small system into a large
- You can deploy web apps to Xojo Cloud with a single click (although it is a little pricy) or you can deploy to a Linux server such as a Digital Ocean droplet for as little as $5 per month (or something like $0.07 per hour). That's really cool. Getting Foxpro supported hosting was pretty expensive and hard. YMMV.
- Don't like the book to learn Xojo? Check out the Xojo YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/user/goxojo
- Want to learn Xojo by example? Xojo comes with *hundreds* of examples covering many many subjects. When I'm trying something that I've never done before, I just click the "New Project > Examples" and choose from the plethora of examples. I wish Foxpro had that many examples when I got started decades ago.
- I've developed a "VFP" class for Xojo to help. Want STRTOFILE() and FILETOSTR() that works cross-platform? STRTRAN()? You can even ADDBS()? I'm happy to share that and it helps ease the transition to Xojo. Eventually I stopped using these functions and went native, but it was nice to transition.
... There is more good stuff about Xojo, but I'll stop here ...
Is it all good stuff? Heck no.
- You cannot press a magic button and convert over your VFP solutions. The languages are cousins of each other, but it will still be a rewrite. I chose to just write new applications in Xojo and eventually I got to all Xojo.
- Data handling is different. Xojo uses recordsets and not cursors. You handle the data a bit more "manually" than the magic of ControlSources. It wasn't a big deal to me, but it does keep you from creating forms with millions of data controls. That might be a good thing?
- The built in report writer is pitiful. For the most part, I write my reports out to HTML/CSS and display into the browser. There is a 3rd party report writer called Bikini Shorts that is really powerful and wicked fast. (https://bkeeney.com/allproducts/bkeeney-shorts/ )
- The Xojo community is pretty nice for the most part, but there are a couple of people that are mean and petty. Be prepared to go into the Xojo forum and read some of that. I think they're full of piss and vinegar because they know that Xojo cares and is listening. For some people, the sky is always falling. Some people just want to see the world burn. Most people are very kind and helpful. That's the aspect to focus on and forget the nasty people. We don't have time for that.
...
Okay. My fingers are moving on to other tasks. All I can say is that I like it and I've created some good business solutions for my employer that I think have made things better! Take Xojo for a spin. I like it and you may as well.
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 4:57 PM To: ProFox Email List profox@leafe.com Subject: RE: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
There's a lot there. I'm out of time for the day unfortunately. Let me give you a full response on my thoughts on migrating to Xojo on Monday sometime.
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Paul H. Tarver Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 12:04 PM To: profox@leafe.com Subject: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit.
I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out.
Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :)
I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen.
Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro.
Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo.
I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications.
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news....
Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right?
I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design.
It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available.
As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process".
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news....
Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity.
“An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said.
https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf...
Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure.
Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!!
Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd.
﴾⚆ᨎ⚆﴿
Flexipol® Packaging Ltd T 01706 222 792 E DCrozier@flexipol.co.uk W https://www.flexipol.co.uk/ Follow us: Unit 14 Bentwood Road, Carrs Industrial Estate, Haslingden, Lancashire, BB4 5HH
This communication and the information it contains is intended for the person or organisation to whom it is addressed. Its contents are confidential and may be protected in law. If you have received this e-mail in error you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. Unauthorised use, copying or disclosure of any of it may be unlawful. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or email.
Flexipol Packaging Ltd. has taken every reasonable precaution to minimise the risk of virus transmission through email and therefore any files sent via e-mail will have been checked for known viruses. However, you are advised to run your own virus check before opening any attachments received as Flexipol Packaging Ltd will not in any event accept any liability whatsoever once an e-mail and/or any attachment is received.
It is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they have adequate virus protection.
Terms & Conditions: Notwithstanding delivery and the passing of risk in the goods, the property in the goods shall not pass to the buyer until the seller Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ("The Company") has received in cash or cleared funds payment in full of the price of the goods and all other goods agreed to be sold by the seller to the buyer for which payment is then due. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer, the buyer shall hold the goods as the seller's fiduciary agent and bailee and keep the goods separate from those of the buyer and third parties and properly stored protected and insured and identified as the seller's property but shall be entitled to resell or use the goods in the ordinary course of its business. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer the seller shall be entitled at any time
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[excessive quoting removed by server]
Why do you need to open up so much and at the end close it down? Shouldn’t every ui do that as needed?
Doesn’t the data get stale if you pull it at onset?
The work I do lately is all processing via a variety of message ques and no ui. You read the message and then identify what if anything you need to do or pass it off to the erp for the work to be done.
Guess I live in a workflow hell. I get the attributes from the message and deal with it on its own terms.
On Fri, Feb 22, 2019 at 11:05 AM Paul H. Tarver paul@tpcqpc.com wrote:
I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit.
I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out.
Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :)
- I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of
tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen.
- Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a
configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro.
- Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can
provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo.
I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications.
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news....
Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right?
I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design.
It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available.
As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process".
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news....
Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity.
“An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said.
https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf...
Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure.
Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!!
Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd.
﴾⚆ᨎ⚆﴿
Flexipol® Packaging Ltd T 01706 222 792 E DCrozier@flexipol.co.uk W https://www.flexipol.co.uk/ Follow us: Unit 14 Bentwood Road https://maps.google.com/?q=Unit+14+Bentwood+Road&entry=gmail&source=g, Carrs Industrial Estate, Haslingden, Lancashire, BB4 5HH
This communication and the information it contains is intended for the person or organisation to whom it is addressed. Its contents are confidential and may be protected in law. If you have received this e-mail in error you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. Unauthorised use, copying or disclosure of any of it may be unlawful. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or email.
Flexipol Packaging Ltd. has taken every reasonable precaution to minimise the risk of virus transmission through email and therefore any files sent via e-mail will have been checked for known viruses. However, you are advised to run your own virus check before opening any attachments received as Flexipol Packaging Ltd will not in any event accept any liability whatsoever once an e-mail and/or any attachment is received.
It is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they have adequate virus protection.
Terms & Conditions: Notwithstanding delivery and the passing of risk in the goods, the property in the goods shall not pass to the buyer until the seller Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ("The Company") has received in cash or cleared funds payment in full of the price of the goods and all other goods agreed to be sold by the seller to the buyer for which payment is then due. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer, the buyer shall hold the goods as the seller's fiduciary agent and bailee and keep the goods separate from those of the buyer and third parties and properly stored protected and insured and identified as the seller's property but shall be entitled to resell or use the goods in the ordinary course of its business. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer the seller shall be entitled at any time
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[excessive quoting removed by server]
Sounds like my needs are different that’s all.
Paul
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 22, 2019, at 4:32 PM, Stephen Russell srussell705@gmail.com wrote:
Why do you need to open up so much and at the end close it down? Shouldn’t every ui do that as needed?
Doesn’t the data get stale if you pull it at onset?
The work I do lately is all processing via a variety of message ques and no ui. You read the message and then identify what if anything you need to do or pass it off to the erp for the work to be done.
Guess I live in a workflow hell. I get the attributes from the message and deal with it on its own terms.
On Fri, Feb 22, 2019 at 11:05 AM Paul H. Tarver paul@tpcqpc.com wrote:
I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit.
I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out.
Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :)
- I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of
tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen.
- Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a
configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro.
- Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can
provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo.
I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications.
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news....
Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right?
I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design.
It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available.
As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process".
-Kevin
-----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news....
Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity.
“An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said.
https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf...
Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure.
Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!!
Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd.
﴾⚆ᨎ⚆﴿
Flexipol® Packaging Ltd T 01706 222 792 E DCrozier@flexipol.co.uk W https://www.flexipol.co.uk/ Follow us: Unit 14 Bentwood Road https://maps.google.com/?q=Unit+14+Bentwood+Road&entry=gmail&source=g, Carrs Industrial Estate, Haslingden, Lancashire, BB4 5HH
This communication and the information it contains is intended for the person or organisation to whom it is addressed. Its contents are confidential and may be protected in law. If you have received this e-mail in error you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. Unauthorised use, copying or disclosure of any of it may be unlawful. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or email.
Flexipol Packaging Ltd. has taken every reasonable precaution to minimise the risk of virus transmission through email and therefore any files sent via e-mail will have been checked for known viruses. However, you are advised to run your own virus check before opening any attachments received as Flexipol Packaging Ltd will not in any event accept any liability whatsoever once an e-mail and/or any attachment is received.
It is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they have adequate virus protection.
Terms & Conditions: Notwithstanding delivery and the passing of risk in the goods, the property in the goods shall not pass to the buyer until the seller Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ("The Company") has received in cash or cleared funds payment in full of the price of the goods and all other goods agreed to be sold by the seller to the buyer for which payment is then due. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer, the buyer shall hold the goods as the seller's fiduciary agent and bailee and keep the goods separate from those of the buyer and third parties and properly stored protected and insured and identified as the seller's property but shall be entitled to resell or use the goods in the ordinary course of its business. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer the seller shall be entitled at any time
--- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/jpeg image/jpeg image/png image/png image/png image/png
[excessive quoting removed by server]
Hi Paul, I think your problem is "love". You just don't love the language, so I'd say ditch it and find something you love, you'll save a lot of effort. Why don't you try Python, and once you've got the bare basics of the language read Prentice Hall's "Rapid GUI programming with Python and Qt" by Mark Summerfield.
As for hiding your code there are nowadays a couple of apps that generate an exe file from Python with no hassles.
So check it out and see if you love this language.
On 22/2/19 14:04, Paul H. Tarver wrote:
I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit. I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out. Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :) 1) I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen. 2) Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro. 3) Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo. I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications. Paul H. Tarver -----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news.... Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right? I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design. It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available. As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process". -Kevin -----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news.... Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity. “An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said. https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf... Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure. Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!! Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ﴾⚆ᨎ⚆﴿ Flexipol® Packaging Ltd T 01706 222 792 E DCrozier@flexipol.co.uk W https://www.flexipol.co.uk/ Follow us: Unit 14 Bentwood Road, Carrs Industrial Estate, Haslingden, Lancashire, BB4 5HH This communication and the information it contains is intended for the person or organisation to whom it is addressed. Its contents are confidential and may be protected in law. If you have received this e-mail in error you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. Unauthorised use, copying or disclosure of any of it may be unlawful. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or email. Flexipol Packaging Ltd. has taken every reasonable precaution to minimise the risk of virus transmission through email and therefore any files sent via e-mail will have been checked for known viruses. However, you are advised to run your own virus check before opening any attachments received as Flexipol Packaging Ltd will not in any event accept any liability whatsoever once an e-mail and/or any attachment is received. It is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they have adequate virus protection.
Terms & Conditions: Notwithstanding delivery and the passing of risk in the goods, the property in the goods shall not pass to the buyer until the seller Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ("The Company") has received in cash or cleared funds payment in full of the price of the goods and all other goods agreed to be sold by the seller to the buyer for which payment is then due. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer, the buyer shall hold the goods as the seller's fiduciary agent and bailee and keep the goods separate from those of the buyer and third parties and properly stored protected and insured and identified as the seller's property but shall be entitled to resell or use the goods in the ordinary course of its business. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer the seller shall be entitled at any time --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/jpeg image/jpeg image/png image/png image/png image/png --- [excessive quoting removed by server] _______________________________________________ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://mail.leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://mail.leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/005b01d4cad0$bce77240$36b656c0$@tpcqp... All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
I’ve already tried python.
There may be some love involved with FoxPro but Python was eliminated from my options because i wanted more of a single provider rather than a bunch of different pieces coming from different providers. I’m sure I’ll trigger a lot of blowback from Python advocates for my comment but I stated originally I wanted to keep this thread on point about Xojo rather than debate the benefits of everyone’s favorite FoxPro replacement.
Paul
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 23, 2019, at 10:52 AM, Ricardo Araoz ricaraoz@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Paul, I think your problem is "love". You just don't love the language, so I'd say ditch it and find something you love, you'll save a lot of effort. Why don't you try Python, and once you've got the bare basics of the language read Prentice Hall's "Rapid GUI programming with Python and Qt" by Mark Summerfield.
As for hiding your code there are nowadays a couple of apps that generate an exe file from Python with no hassles.
So check it out and see if you love this language.
On 22/2/19 14:04, Paul H. Tarver wrote: I hijacked the original thread with a reply changing the subject and adding an [NF] flag to the subject because a small comment Kevin made caused me chase a different rabbit for a little bit. I have reviewed Xojo on a couple of different occasions over the past few years and I have tried to work my way through the book that was written to teach people how to program it and I find myself drifting by the 3rd or 4th chapter every time. Not a fault of the author; just rather a fault of me wanting something a little more advanced. Anyway, I've run into a couple of hurdles with trying to learn Xojo and perhaps someone here has some suggestions to help me out. Try not to laugh at what may be very dumb questions! :) 1) I build a lot of similar but customized apps using a shared library of tools I've developed over the past 25 years. Every app I build contains a LOT of forms, reports and programs shared by all my applications as well as a lot of forms, reports and programs which are copied from previous projects and then customized for the current client. While I have seen multiple Xojo advocates confirm a similar process is possible, but I cannot find clear explanations of how to make that happen. 2) Every Foxpro application I build starts with a .PRG which reads a configuration .INI file and then setups up the environment, displays a splash screen, checks my version numbers, calls a database update process if a version change is detected and if all is good, it displays the main screen for the user. Once the user chooses to exit my application, a shutdown process is initiated and everything is closed in an orderly way. That having been said, I have been unable to find source code to a simple, complete Xojo application or instruction book that can walk me through the start to finish logic and firing order of all the start-up and shut-down events and allow me to compare that to the process I'm so familiar with in Foxpro. 3) Are there any good white-papers or books by Foxpro programmers that can provide insights into translating my Foxpro knowledge and skill directly into Xojo. I use Foxpro on a daily basis for my business because I cannot find a language that satisfies my clients' needs the way Foxpro does. I would love to be able to say I have a backup language like Xojo, but I get only so far before I give up and go back to what I know and love. So let's assume Kevin is correct when he states Xojo is " a viable language for VFP developers" because I do not want to go down the rabbit hole of considering all the other alternatives for this sake of this discussion and share with me any tips that can help me understand Xojo on a higher level beyond just creating a simple form. I want to understand Xojo at a Complete Deliverable Application level and talk about mimicking the features I depend upon in Foxpro to share a library of tools, forms and code across hundreds of similar custom applications. Paul H. Tarver -----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kevin J Cully Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 8:11 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: false news.... Well, a lot of that article is correct, even though I don't want it to be. VFP as a *language* is as secure as the programmer programmed it to be. VFP as a *database* isn't secure itself. You can encrypt fields. You can encrypt the directory that the data is stored in. But DBF data isn't secure. You wouldn't store social security numbers or credit card numbers in Excel spreadsheets, right? I've haven't recommended DBFs for storage for over a decade now. There are better storage mechanisms such as Postgres, MariaDB, and even SQLite which can be set up as an encrypted database. VFP as a language is still valid, although it will never be able to create 64bit applications but that is a different subject. [Insert Xojo plug here as a viable language for VFP developers.] I had a potential client where they based their primary keys based on employee Social Security Numbers. They didn't like it when I told them that they'd need a complete rewrite. Notice this would have been the case no matter what language/technology they were using. It was just piss poor design. It appears from the article, that when the vendor was notified of the situation, that they were able to quickly address it although the article didn't say what that solution was. Probably encrypted the field? Hash the field with an external secured table containing the sensitive data? Who knows. To me, that's a win. Hopefully the vendor contacts all customers notifying them that there is a vulnerability and that there is a solution available. As Ted Roche always says "Security is a process". -Kevin -----Original Message----- From: ProFox [mailto:profox-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Dave Crozier Sent: Friday, February 22, 2019 6:07 AM To: 'ProFox Email List' profox@leafe.com Subject: VFP: false news.... Ignorance and stupidity still runs in the so-called “expert consultant” fraternity. “An outdated software that is used by about 200 Vermont municipalities and the Vermont Tax Department has long contained flaws that exposed sensitive information including Social Security numbers, according to an IT consultant and the software company’s founder.” “You could make a strong case that Visual FoxPro shouldn’t be used on a government level,” Johnson said. https://vtdigger.org/2019/02/05/consultant-outdated-software-left-worker-inf... Thankfully the software owners realise that it isn’t a fault in VFP, it is a fault in the designing of the infrastructure. Expert: Ex - Out of date Spurt – a drip under pressure!! Dave Crozier Software Development Manager Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ﴾⚆ᨎ⚆﴿ Flexipol® Packaging Ltd T 01706 222 792 E DCrozier@flexipol.co.uk W https://www.flexipol.co.uk/ Follow us: Unit 14 Bentwood Road, Carrs Industrial Estate, Haslingden, Lancashire, BB4 5HH This communication and the information it contains is intended for the person or organisation to whom it is addressed. Its contents are confidential and may be protected in law. If you have received this e-mail in error you must not copy, distribute or take any action in reliance on it. Unauthorised use, copying or disclosure of any of it may be unlawful. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately by telephone or email. Flexipol Packaging Ltd. has taken every reasonable precaution to minimise the risk of virus transmission through email and therefore any files sent via e-mail will have been checked for known viruses. However, you are advised to run your own virus check before opening any attachments received as Flexipol Packaging Ltd will not in any event accept any liability whatsoever once an e-mail and/or any attachment is received. It is the responsibility of the recipient to ensure that they have adequate virus protection. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Terms & Conditions: Notwithstanding delivery and the passing of risk in the goods, the property in the goods shall not pass to the buyer until the seller Flexipol Packaging Ltd. ("The Company") has received in cash or cleared funds payment in full of the price of the goods and all other goods agreed to be sold by the seller to the buyer for which payment is then due. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer, the buyer shall hold the goods as the seller's fiduciary agent and bailee and keep the goods separate from those of the buyer and third parties and properly stored protected and insured and identified as the seller's property but shall be entitled to resell or use the goods in the ordinary course of its business. Until such time as the property in the goods passes to the buyer the seller shall be entitled at any time --- StripMime Report -- processed MIME parts --- multipart/related multipart/alternative text/plain (text body -- kept) text/html image/jpeg image/jpeg image/png image/png image/png image/png --- [excessive quoting removed by server] _______________________________________________ Post Messages to: ProFox@leafe.com Subscription Maintenance: http://mail.leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profox OT-free version of this list: http://mail.leafe.com/mailman/listinfo/profoxtech Searchable Archive: http://leafe.com/archives/search/profox This message: http://leafe.com/archives/byMID/profox/005b01d4cad0$bce77240$36b656c0$@tpcqp... All postings, unless explicitly stated otherwise, are the opinions of the author, and do not constitute legal or medical advice. This statement is added to the messages for those lawyers who are too stupid to see the obvious.
[excessive quoting removed by server]
Hi Paul,
rather than debate the benefits of everyone’s favorite FoxPro replacement <<
Dude, have you considered Lianja? Then you could use VFP, Phyton, PHP and JS at the same time!
Just teasing... 😊
wOOdy
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: ProFox profox-bounces@leafe.com Im Auftrag von Paul H. Tarver Gesendet: Sonntag, 24. Februar 2019 03:38 An: profox@leafe.com Betreff: Re: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
I’ve already tried python.
There may be some love involved with FoxPro but Python was eliminated from my options because i wanted more of a single provider rather than a bunch of different pieces coming from different providers. I’m sure I’ll trigger a lot of blowback from Python advocates for my comment but I stated originally I wanted to keep this thread on point about Xojo rather than debate the benefits of everyone’s favorite FoxPro replacement.
Paul
Got me. Made me laugh. Thanks!
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of juergen@wondzinski.de Sent: Sunday, February 24, 2019 3:31 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: AW: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
Hi Paul,
rather than debate the benefits of everyone’s favorite FoxPro replacement <<
Dude, have you considered Lianja? Then you could use VFP, Phyton, PHP and JS at the same time!
Just teasing... 😊
wOOdy
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: ProFox profox-bounces@leafe.com Im Auftrag von Paul H. Tarver Gesendet: Sonntag, 24. Februar 2019 03:38 An: profox@leafe.com Betreff: Re: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
I’ve already tried python.
There may be some love involved with FoxPro but Python was eliminated from my options because i wanted more of a single provider rather than a bunch of different pieces coming from different providers. I’m sure I’ll trigger a lot of blowback from Python advocates for my comment but I stated originally I wanted to keep this thread on point about Xojo rather than debate the benefits of everyone’s favorite FoxPro replacement.
Paul
[excessive quoting removed by server]
That is some funny stuff wOOdy!
Myself - I am RIGHT NOW looking at some FoxPro alternatives for this UCLA Job (mentioned in another thread) - and then just sent me an email this morning about looking at FoxPro alternatives. They have a list of them, including Alpha SW, Servoy, FoxInCloud & even the Westwind stuff (although I didn't think Westwind offered a full replacement). Was surprised they did NOT mention XoJo - and I may mention that to them.
I will follow-up here shortly with a new thread about this - as I do NOT Want to HiJack this thread - which Paul already kinda Hijacked (although, not really - since he gave it a fully new Subject line).
-K-
On 2/24/2019 1:30 AM, juergen@wondzinski.de wrote:
Hi Paul,
rather than debate the benefits of everyone’s favorite FoxPro replacement <<
Dude, have you considered Lianja? Then you could use VFP, Phyton, PHP and JS at the same time!
Just teasing... 😊
wOOdy
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: ProFox profox-bounces@leafe.com Im Auftrag von Paul H. Tarver Gesendet: Sonntag, 24. Februar 2019 03:38 An: profox@leafe.com Betreff: Re: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
I’ve already tried python.
There may be some love involved with FoxPro but Python was eliminated from my options because i wanted more of a single provider rather than a bunch of different pieces coming from different providers. I’m sure I’ll trigger a lot of blowback from Python advocates for my comment but I stated originally I wanted to keep this thread on point about Xojo rather than debate the benefits of everyone’s favorite FoxPro replacement.
Paul
[excessive quoting removed by server]
As a thread hijacker I always try to be courteous! :)
PS: I've committed in my head to try to make a concerted effort to dig deeper into Xojo based on some of the feedback on this thread. But it's a challenge. I have an internal management tool that I wrote years ago to use in my computer repair shop I'd like to try to rebuild this next year on Xojo as my learning method. It's a relatively simple database with a straight-forward UI and well-defined rules. I find I learn better in the trenches using books as references as opposed to following prescribed mini-projects most learning to code books offer. We will see how it goes and how much time I can devote to this, but the encouragement I get from this group makes a big difference! Thank y'all for that!
Paul H. Tarver
-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Kurt at VR-FX Sent: Monday, March 11, 2019 3:43 PM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: Re: AW: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
That is some funny stuff wOOdy!
Myself - I am RIGHT NOW looking at some FoxPro alternatives for this UCLA Job (mentioned in another thread) - and then just sent me an email this morning about looking at FoxPro alternatives. They have a list of them, including Alpha SW, Servoy, FoxInCloud & even the Westwind stuff (although I didn't think Westwind offered a full replacement). Was surprised they did NOT mention XoJo - and I may mention that to them.
I will follow-up here shortly with a new thread about this - as I do NOT Want to HiJack this thread - which Paul already kinda Hijacked (although, not really - since he gave it a fully new Subject line).
-K-
On 2/24/2019 1:30 AM, juergen@wondzinski.de wrote:
Hi Paul,
rather than debate the benefits of everyone’s favorite FoxPro replacement <<
Dude, have you considered Lianja? Then you could use VFP, Phyton, PHP and JS at the same time!
Just teasing... 😊
wOOdy
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: ProFox profox-bounces@leafe.com Im Auftrag von Paul H. Tarver Gesendet: Sonntag, 24. Februar 2019 03:38 An: profox@leafe.com Betreff: Re: [NF] Migrating Skills From Foxpro to Xojo
I’ve already tried python.
There may be some love involved with FoxPro but Python was eliminated from my options because i wanted more of a single provider rather than a bunch of different pieces coming from different providers. I’m sure I’ll trigger a lot of blowback from Python advocates for my comment but I stated originally I wanted to keep this thread on point about Xojo rather than debate the benefits of everyone’s favorite FoxPro replacement.
Paul
[excessive quoting removed by server]
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Alan Bourke -
Ed Leafe -
Fletcher Johnson -
Johan Nel -
juergen＠wondzinski.de -
Ken McGinnis -
Kevin Cully -
Kevin J Cully -
Koen Piller -
Kurt ＠ Gmail -
Kurt at VR-FX -
Malcolm Greene -
MB Software Solutions, LLC -
Paul H. Tarver -
Ricardo Araoz -
Stephen Russell -
Ted Roche -
Tracy Pearson