I gotta say - Mike - if its people all doing personal usage - you shouldn't have to support that since its NOT Work related. Here at my job - security is a Huge issue - since the co. is centered around financial data. As such, we have NO Free WiFi access. Oh well...

I WILL keep an eye on this thread - since if it sheds any light on your issue - maybe it will help shed light on my own problem at my place.

Regards, Kurt Wendt Consultant

Tel. +1-212-747-9100 www.GlobeTax.com

-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Mike Copeland Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2016 5:56 PM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: Re: [NF] WIFI Blues

Exactly. I've checked a few of the phones that won't route and they have a valid IP address, they have a valid gateway value, but no DNS.

The problem I am dealing with is a couple hundred employees who have come to expect free high-speed WIFI at work for their cell phones and tablets (personal stuff, not work related.) And I'm astounded at how rapidly people change phones!!! I looked at one guy's Android phone a couple weeks ago, and yesterday he shows up with an iPhone. A girl I helped connect her Android last Friday sent me an email today "warning" me that she is getting a new iPhone by the end of the week and she's heard that people are having trouble getting WIFI on their iPhones.

What I've done on the Androids is remove the WIFI connection from the previous connection (the WAP hasn't changed, but I did change the password at the beginning of January) and then reconnect. So far I've only had one Android that didn't work on.

There's a similar 'fix' touted for the iPhone when you google the problem, but so far it hasn't worked once on nearly a dozen phones.

The problem is almost identical each time (the wording changes depending on whether it's Android, iPhone, and what flavor of Android.) It prompts for password, accepts password, indicates it is getting connection details (IP, etc.) and then it finally finishes without further indication there's a problem. But when you try to access the Internet, it routes through the phones data connection (LTE4 or 3 or whatever their carrier provides) and not WIFI.

I've looked at the DHCP server and it shows the devices by MAC address, with a valid associated IP and lease. Everything on the DHCP servers looks right.

I'm going to replace the routers and try having the router assign the DHCP values and see how that flies. Nothing else is working.

Thanks!

Mike

Ted Roche wrote:

Yikes. That sounds like a "fun" problem. Sorry, bro.

You say it seems to be a DNS problem. Why do you think that?

There are info screens on iPhones and Androids that will show you IP address & DNS settings, though they are often difficult to find. My Android will happily set DNS1 & 2 to 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 if you don't specify. Do you block devices that want to use their own DNS settings?

On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 4:21 PM, Mike Copeland mike@ggisoft.com wrote:

...

Anyone else having problems with WIFI WAPs starting to refuse connections to iPhones?

I manage several building networks that have WAP devices, and I've started getting complaints in the last couple of months about "my cellphone won't connect." It seems that the connection happens, but the data won't route. From what I can tell it's a DNS issue. (The WAP is on an isolated network with a DHCP server that provides an IP, gateway, and DNS settings when connected.)

I've Googled this and read for hours, and I have found some "fixs" that didn't work when tried. Mostly it's iPhone 6's but a couple of Android phones, too. No idea what flavor of Android.

It is happening with both Cisco WAPs (Aironets) and Netgear. And once a device connects, it's happy happy to come and go, reconnecting as needed.

Any WIFI gurus in the crowd?

Thanks!

Mike Copeland

[excessive quoting removed by server]

Asked? Nooo. They tell ME.

"But, I have to use my data plan while I'm at work to watch GLEE..., uh, I mean to access important communications about my children at school!"

They're savvy enough to know when they're not getting WIFI throughput, and they don't like it! And yes, it's all personal. Well, to be fair there might be an occasional work-related something...I dunno. It could happen.

But who cares? I'm not interested in playing data cop; much easier to just provide a path for their needs. Laissez le bon temps rouler!

Mike

David Smith wrote:

Have you asked them to just turn off their data while they are trying to use your WiFi? It can't go through the LTE etc if it's turned off.

---

From: ProfoxTech profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com on behalf of Kurt Wendt Kurt_Wendt@globetax.com Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2016 9:55 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: RE: [NF] WIFI Blues

I gotta say - Mike - if its people all doing personal usage - you shouldn't have to support that since its NOT Work related. Here at my job - security is a Huge issue - since the co. is centered around financial data. As such, we have NO Free WiFi access. Oh well...

I WILL keep an eye on this thread - since if it sheds any light on your issue - maybe it will help shed light on my own problem at my place.

Regards, Kurt Wendt Consultant

Tel. +1-212-747-9100 www.GlobeTax.com

-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Mike Copeland Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2016 5:56 PM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: Re: [NF] WIFI Blues

Exactly. I've checked a few of the phones that won't route and they have a valid IP address, they have a valid gateway value, but no DNS.

The problem I am dealing with is a couple hundred employees who have come to expect free high-speed WIFI at work for their cell phones and tablets (personal stuff, not work related.) And I'm astounded at how rapidly people change phones!!! I looked at one guy's Android phone a couple weeks ago, and yesterday he shows up with an iPhone. A girl I helped connect her Android last Friday sent me an email today "warning" me that she is getting a new iPhone by the end of the week and she's heard that people are having trouble getting WIFI on their iPhones.

What I've done on the Androids is remove the WIFI connection from the previous connection (the WAP hasn't changed, but I did change the password at the beginning of January) and then reconnect. So far I've only had one Android that didn't work on.

There's a similar 'fix' touted for the iPhone when you google the problem, but so far it hasn't worked once on nearly a dozen phones.

The problem is almost identical each time (the wording changes depending on whether it's Android, iPhone, and what flavor of Android.) It prompts for password, accepts password, indicates it is getting connection details (IP, etc.) and then it finally finishes without further indication there's a problem. But when you try to access the Internet, it routes through the phones data connection (LTE4 or 3 or whatever their carrier provides) and not WIFI.

I've looked at the DHCP server and it shows the devices by MAC address, with a valid associated IP and lease. Everything on the DHCP servers looks right.

I'm going to replace the routers and try having the router assign the DHCP values and see how that flies. Nothing else is working.

Thanks!

Mike

Ted Roche wrote:

...

Yikes. That sounds like a "fun" problem. Sorry, bro.

You say it seems to be a DNS problem. Why do you think that?

There are info screens on iPhones and Androids that will show you IP address & DNS settings, though they are often difficult to find. My Android will happily set DNS1 & 2 to 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 if you don't specify. Do you block devices that want to use their own DNS settings?

On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 4:21 PM, Mike Copeland mike@ggisoft.com wrote:

...

Anyone else having problems with WIFI WAPs starting to refuse connections to iPhones?

I manage several building networks that have WAP devices, and I've started getting complaints in the last couple of months about "my cellphone won't connect." It seems that the connection happens, but the data won't route. From what I can tell it's a DNS issue. (The WAP is on an isolated network with a DHCP server that provides an IP, gateway, and DNS settings when connected.)

I've Googled this and read for hours, and I have found some "fixs" that didn't work when tried. Mostly it's iPhone 6's but a couple of Android phones, too. No idea what flavor of Android.

It is happening with both Cisco WAPs (Aironets) and Netgear. And once a device connects, it's happy happy to come and go, reconnecting as needed.

Any WIFI gurus in the crowd?

Thanks!

Mike Copeland

[excessive quoting removed by server]

Honestly - I wish they Would offer free WiFi access here at work - it would be nice!

Regards, Kurt Wendt Consultant

Tel. +1-212-747-9100 www.GlobeTax.com

-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Ted Roche Sent: Wednesday, February 10, 2016 10:52 AM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: Re: [NF] WIFI Blues

On Wed, Feb 10, 2016 at 9:55 AM, Kurt Wendt Kurt_Wendt@globetax.com wrote:

I gotta say - Mike - if its people all doing personal usage - you shouldn't have to support that since its NOT Work related. Here at my job - security is a Huge issue - since the co. is centered around financial data. As such, we have NO Free WiFi access. Oh well...

I gotta say, Kurt, I tried to answer this, but realized my answer went way [OT].

I can say, I think employers who provide public Wifi for their employees' and guests' personal use, firewalled from their corporate network, are cool in my book. And perhaps a little more secure.

-- Ted Roche Ted Roche & Associates, LLC http://www.tedroche.com

[excessive quoting removed by server]

Kurt,

Thanks for the confirmation by the way! (previous email)

I've gone 180 degrees on the WIFI at work issue over the last year. I was the original "that's tough, use your data plan" guy, but as I've dealt with problems (people getting on the WIFI access in the building which was installed for the management to use their laptops on...."hey! How did you get the password?" "Oh, Bob told me...") I've given up and decided that a safe (emphasis on my data network being SAFE) WIFI service with a fairly simple password that changed every 30 days is the best approach.

"Bring your tablets! Connect your cell! Come one come all! Connect all day, stay all night!" works a lot better than fighting and searching for rogue hardware that has been plugged in to USB ports.

So, I have a WIFI WAP for anyone to use, and it has its own router/ firewall and its own public IP. It is completely isolated and shares nothing but the monthly invoice from the ISP for the "Internet services." I tell people that if they use it they can go anywhere and do anything, including get infected and hacked. Enjoy! (And I don't support personal devices unless you're an owner or member of the board of directors.)

Now, I no longer have to deal with "Can I connect my ______ to the building network? Why not!?" questions from every former Best Buy salesperson they hire. Instead, I send out regular notices that "Any electronic device found connected by wire to anything other than an electrical outlet can be found at my office in the box labeled trash."

It really boils down to a new attitude I'm encountering among the 20-somethings that says "I have a right to access the Internet at all times and all places." Rather than fight it, I embrace and encourage it.

"HEY HEY HEY! Connect to WAP1 access point on your device and use the password LETSGO! Password will be changed from time to time, so stay tuned!"

And yes, I do still have a WAP that is NOT accessible to anyone but me, since I'm the only one with the password (which is a very long arcane string of gibberish.) If someone (management) wants to access company files, no problem! Bring your laptop to me and I'll key the password in for you. (All laptops have Admin accounts so to see or remove the password on the WAP connection requires admin privilege.)

So far management has given total buy in, which was accomplished by throwing the security issues in their lap for a year or two until they got tired of dealing with every i-something that got carried in the door. They finally said "You deal with it, but don't get us in trouble."

And so it goes. :)

Mike Copeland

Kurt Wendt wrote:

I gotta say - Mike - if its people all doing personal usage - you shouldn't have to support that since its NOT Work related. Here at my job - security is a Huge issue - since the co. is centered around financial data. As such, we have NO Free WiFi access. Oh well...

I WILL keep an eye on this thread - since if it sheds any light on your issue - maybe it will help shed light on my own problem at my place.

Regards, Kurt Wendt Consultant

Tel. +1-212-747-9100 www.GlobeTax.com

-----Original Message----- From: ProfoxTech [mailto:profoxtech-bounces@leafe.com] On Behalf Of Mike Copeland Sent: Tuesday, February 09, 2016 5:56 PM To: profoxtech@leafe.com Subject: Re: [NF] WIFI Blues

Exactly. I've checked a few of the phones that won't route and they have a valid IP address, they have a valid gateway value, but no DNS.

The problem I am dealing with is a couple hundred employees who have come to expect free high-speed WIFI at work for their cell phones and tablets (personal stuff, not work related.) And I'm astounded at how rapidly people change phones!!! I looked at one guy's Android phone a couple weeks ago, and yesterday he shows up with an iPhone. A girl I helped connect her Android last Friday sent me an email today "warning" me that she is getting a new iPhone by the end of the week and she's heard that people are having trouble getting WIFI on their iPhones.

What I've done on the Androids is remove the WIFI connection from the previous connection (the WAP hasn't changed, but I did change the password at the beginning of January) and then reconnect. So far I've only had one Android that didn't work on.

There's a similar 'fix' touted for the iPhone when you google the problem, but so far it hasn't worked once on nearly a dozen phones.

The problem is almost identical each time (the wording changes depending on whether it's Android, iPhone, and what flavor of Android.) It prompts for password, accepts password, indicates it is getting connection details (IP, etc.) and then it finally finishes without further indication there's a problem. But when you try to access the Internet, it routes through the phones data connection (LTE4 or 3 or whatever their carrier provides) and not WIFI.

I've looked at the DHCP server and it shows the devices by MAC address, with a valid associated IP and lease. Everything on the DHCP servers looks right.

I'm going to replace the routers and try having the router assign the DHCP values and see how that flies. Nothing else is working.

Thanks!

Mike

Ted Roche wrote:

...

Yikes. That sounds like a "fun" problem. Sorry, bro.

You say it seems to be a DNS problem. Why do you think that?

There are info screens on iPhones and Androids that will show you IP address & DNS settings, though they are often difficult to find. My Android will happily set DNS1 & 2 to 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 if you don't specify. Do you block devices that want to use their own DNS settings?

On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 4:21 PM, Mike Copeland mike@ggisoft.com wrote:

...

Anyone else having problems with WIFI WAPs starting to refuse connections to iPhones?

I manage several building networks that have WAP devices, and I've started getting complaints in the last couple of months about "my cellphone won't connect." It seems that the connection happens, but the data won't route. From what I can tell it's a DNS issue. (The WAP is on an isolated network with a DHCP server that provides an IP, gateway, and DNS settings when connected.)

I've Googled this and read for hours, and I have found some "fixs" that didn't work when tried. Mostly it's iPhone 6's but a couple of Android phones, too. No idea what flavor of Android.

It is happening with both Cisco WAPs (Aironets) and Netgear. And once a device connects, it's happy happy to come and go, reconnecting as needed.

Any WIFI gurus in the crowd?

Thanks!

Mike Copeland

[excessive quoting removed by server]

There are some enlightened employers who recognize that an employee who gets their job done is doing what's asked of him/her, even if they have their phone streaming sports highlights all day.

OTOH, I knew of an employer who required employees to only use their phones on breaks or lunch. Some employees could literally not stop texting, updating Facester or whatever it was they were doing. After several warnings and careful documentation, they were terminated.

So, I think people are all over the place on this. Of course, it depends on your job, too. If you're just supposed to answer the phone when it rings, it's probably more okay than if you're supposed to be watching the radar of incoming planes. If you're paid to think, you shouldn't be thinking about your next blog post. OTO,OH, I work out my best algorithms walking the dogs...

As usual, the optimum is likely somewhere in the middle.

On Thu, Feb 11, 2016 at 4:38 AM, AndyHC jarndice@gmail.com wrote:

Things have certainly changed - my last real job I got grilled by middle management for well over an hour because they'd trawled the network logs and I had been spending some hours a week on this and other tech. sites. I was employed as a FoxPro developer and at the same time was learning web development without any help. My explanation was accepted - very grudgingly.

On 11/02/2016 03:39, Mike Copeland wrote:

...

.... It really boils down to a new attitude I'm encountering among the 20-somethings that says "I have a right to access the Internet at all times and all places." ...........

[excessive quoting removed by server]

"Bring your tablets! Connect your cell! Come one come all! Connect all day, stay all night!" works a lot better than fighting and searching for rogue hardware that has been plugged in to USB ports.

What does this do to your internet bandwidth? In my experience just a few people streaming Pandora or Netflix can bring a network to its knees unless there is a buttload of bandwidth.

Seriously, what speed is your internet?

Ken Dibble www.stic-cil.org

Traffic shaping is your friend.

Many routers let you prioritize and/or maximize the amount of traffic by type/protocol/port. Most video players are pretty savvy about downshifting the resolution/ frames per seconds and caching so viewers can still have an adequate experience with limited bandwidth. Obviously, you're not going to put a lot of effort into what is essentially an employee perk, but 200 Mbps is a lot of bandwidth and ought to serve the group really well for a long time.

On Sat, Feb 13, 2016 at 11:34 PM, Mike Copeland mike@ggisoft.com wrote:

Ken Dibble wrote:

...

What does this do to your internet bandwidth?

Ken Dibble www.stic-cil.org

Thanks, Ken.

So far, not seeing an impact, but I do monitor it closely. Especially on game days in the fall (college football) and of course with the upcoming Olympics in August it could be an issue.

The owners of the company have a very unique mentality that would best be described as "we want the employees to like working here" to which I would add that both of the principals are also big on the employees like them, the owners. That goes a long way towards permitting and allowing a lot of behavior that I have long railed against, been ignored, and later proven right about when the behavior became outrageous. But...as I keep telling myself, it's not my decision.

If I do detect, and can demonstrate, that the WIFI is creating bandwidth issues, then there's always the throttling approach, and maybe someday it will be necessary to discontinue the current free-for-all, but until then I am finding it far far easier to direct rather than detect and fight. Thanks for the thought cycles!

Mike Copeland

[excessive quoting removed by server]